WIPO Director Gurry Speaks On Naming New Cabinet, Future Of WIPO

On the day of his re-election, 8 May, WIPO Director General Francis Gurry spoke briefly to Catherine Saez of Intellectual Property Watch on the process for selection of his senior management team and his vision for the future of the organisation. Gurry focussed on the need to manage the political dialogue to smooth the road to agreement, to create a seamless global legal digital marketplace, and the importance of multi-stakeholder dialogue to help give a “reality check” to discussions inside the organisation.

INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY WATCH (IPW): What is the process for the new senior management team selection?

FRANCIS GURRY (GURRY): The process will start on Monday actually. I hope on Monday or Tuesday to send out invitations to states to nominate candidates and also to invite candidates to nominate themselves directly, if they wish. That will be open for about six weeks and then we will start to assess, evaluate, and form a team. Then I will have to consult with the member states at the end of August/beginning of September. And then put the formal propositions to the General Assemblies at the end of September.

IPW: How do you see the future of WIPO?

GURRY: I listened to the statements made by member states today and I think there is a fair amount of agreement about the strategic goals of the organisation, a global IP system, developing the legal framework, and improving the capacities of the developing countries. What we have to try to do is to build a better shared understanding of the value of IP because people have different ideas about that. As I also said this morning I think the best way to do that is around specific issues.

I hope we can take broadcasting and understand what the contribution of IP is there and why it is important. I hope we can take traditional knowledge and do that, and understand there is an intellectual contribution there. We have to isolate that and reward that but there are other issues on our agenda. They just seem to me to be a good representation of both ends of the spectrum. Broadcasting is highly technologically developed and highly mobile and Traditional Knowledge tends to be the interest of developing countries.

This morning, I thought to enumerate some of the obstacles that we have and everybody knows those but it is true, there are massive trust deficits. So that influences people’s capacity to agree. There are massive asymmetries of information and knowledge and opportunities and wills, and that obviously influences the way people look at intellectual property. It is also competitive interests. People do not want to give up their competitive position and that I think makes it more difficult.

These are the challenges. This is not getting easier, it is getting more and more difficult, but I do not see that as a negative development. It is a just a consequence of the increased importance of the area.

It means that we have to manage the political dialogue better. Try to create a process that would calm those tensions that constitute obstacles to agreement.

IPW: Do you have immediate particular projects?

GURRY: The one thing I am really interested in doing – and I am glad it was picked up by some delegations this morning – is focusing on an efficient seamless legal global digital marketplace. Let me give you an example. For as long as it is easier to get content illegally than it is to get it legally, there is an encouragement to piracy. We have to make the conditions to get it legally better than illegally and that is the global digital marketplace.

Let me give you another example: if one of the HBO series comes out in a new season in, for example, the US but is not available in the new season in certain other countries. What do people do? Do they wait patiently for three months? No, because they are addicted! So this is where I think our objective ought be a seamless global legal digital marketplace and I think everyone has agreed on this.

Now I do not think this is a legislative exercise. This is something that involves a little bit of legislation, for example, the Bruce Willis problem, which is that he has 50,000 songs that he has bought on iTunes, can he give them to his children? If it were 50,000 CDs, he could. So there are some legislative tweaks. But it is mainly about better business models, which is for the private sector to do. It is about improving the culture and understanding, it is about infrastructure, and data standards. That marketplace is a marketplace of data. Metadata constitute creative work and metadata have to talk to each other, so I would like to see us working on developing in a multi-stakeholder dialogue a loose roadmap of things that need to be done to achieve the efficient seamless legal global digital marketplace.

It is important that people understand that this is not about a treaty, and this is not about legislation. It is about helping the world to have a dialogue on how to arrive at this marketplace.

IPW: This morning some developed countries said 90% of WIPO’s revenue come from fees paid by users of the IP system, who should be given particular attention.

GURRY: The reality of the world today is that you need to have multi-stakeholder dialogues. For example, we were able to have the Beijing Treaty because the actors and the studios were involved. We were able to have the Marrakesh Treaty because the publishers and the World Blind Union were involved. If they had not been involved, they would have created obstacles. So we have to get them involved.

I think we do need to sometimes have a reality check to our discussions. Why are we doing this? We are doing it ultimately to improve innovation and the creative industries. Innovation is the biggest component of economic growth, it leads to improved quality of life for everyone, it solves our social challenges. That’s why we are doing this but we need to hear from the marketplace, how we are doing, and what they need.

I understand perfectly that states do not want to negotiate with the private sector but I think they can listen and talk to them. The private sector includes civil society.

IPW: On a lighter mood, now that you have been re-elected, what will you do tomorrow morning?

GURRY: I am going to have a leisurely breakfast!

[Editor’s note: In this interview, Gurry was not asked about more sensitive issues, such as management issues raised by some member states.]